I ve been looking for a cator based 2T oil i.e Castrol A747,Agip Kart 2T and I m sure there are a few other brands.Unfortunately,not much luck here in Toyland,sorry Thailand.Is it possible to mix the castor oil in,say a couple of drops with a good synthetic 2T oil ?
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TZ250K
TZR250 3XV Sugo kitted track
TZR250 3XV modified road
NSR250R MC21 Rothmans
NSR250R MC18 Modified road
NS400R
Dio 80cc big bore with 26mm flatslide (wicked)
900RR Fireblade

Are you just after the smell? Not much benefit otherwise these days, over a good fully-synthetic.

If you just want the smell, stick a cap full in the fuel tank. You don't need much... allegedly!
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Andy.
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Not just the smell Andy I believe it also coats the workings of the engine,stops the carb slides from sticking and is an added protection against siezures ? Just a thourght ?
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My Bikes;
TZ250K
TZR250 3XV Sugo kitted track
TZR250 3XV modified road
NSR250R MC21 Rothmans
NSR250R MC18 Modified road
NS400R
Dio 80cc big bore with 26mm flatslide (wicked)
900RR Fireblade

How would it stop the carb slides from sticking - it's injected downstream of the carbs?

Even if you pre-mix, the fuel shouldn't be getting onto the slides, it lives in the float bowl until it's sucked into the engine...
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MC21SP Plaything
BMW F800GS Bumblebee
Triumph 9551 Daytona Big boys toy
FJ1100 Sporting relic
GTS1000 oddball

I guess if there were power jets included in the equation ? It s just an added precaution ? Cylinders,pistons,rings ? I think well worth taking note and if it s just a case of adding a few drops to yer pre-mix or pumped,why not ?
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My Bikes;
TZ250K
TZR250 3XV Sugo kitted track
TZR250 3XV modified road
NSR250R MC21 Rothmans
NSR250R MC18 Modified road
NS400R
Dio 80cc big bore with 26mm flatslide (wicked)
900RR Fireblade

Because a modern fully synthetic two stroke oil is all your engine needs. It outperforms anything else for lubricating your engine.

Would you put coal in your petrol tank just because they used it in steam engines?
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MC21SP Plaything
BMW F800GS Bumblebee
Triumph 9551 Daytona Big boys toy
FJ1100 Sporting relic
GTS1000 oddball

I love you guys.
Castrol A747 is meant to be the best 2T you can buy,ask anyone that knows anything about 2T and its castor based ? I m surprised yer not up on this sort of stuff Dave Ett ?
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My Bikes;
TZ250K
TZR250 3XV Sugo kitted track
TZR250 3XV modified road
NSR250R MC21 Rothmans
NSR250R MC18 Modified road
NS400R
Dio 80cc big bore with 26mm flatslide (wicked)
900RR Fireblade

I have been using Rock Oil Castor in the NSR for a few sessions now, and it seems to be working ok.

I always seem to end up with fuel vapour blowing back out through the carb, so guess it does coat the slides nicely. It's a bit higher maintenance though, must drain the carbs and tank after every meet otherwise it can gum bits up.
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More **** two strokes than you can shake a **** stick at.

maximum wrote:I love you guys.
Castrol A747 is meant to be the best 2T you can buy,ask anyone that knows anything about 2T and its castor based ? I m surprised yer not up on this sort of stuff Dave Ett ?

Oh I appreciate it is based on other 'stuff' (castor being one) but its the additives that are, er, added which make the fully synth stuff so much better than plain old dinosaur oil.

As I understand it, castor does gum things up terribly and requires a lot more maintenance to keep things running cleanly than something more modern...
_________________
MC21SP Plaything
BMW F800GS Bumblebee
Triumph 9551 Daytona Big boys toy
FJ1100 Sporting relic
GTS1000 oddball

Castrol A747 was one of the best racing 2T oils in the days where fully synthetic high performance 2T oils were in an earlier stage of development.
Castor oil is a superb boundary lubricant, even by modern standards, but 747 is only for premix, it is too viscous for an injector.
However, the latest fully synthetic 2T race oils offer equally good lubrication properties, and don't pose a possible risk of 'gumming up' (note 'possible').
Castrol had to develop a modern version of 747, called XR-77 (fully synthetic) because 747 didn't mix as well with Unleaded as it did with AVGAS.
This too is also premix only.

For an NSR wih an oil injector, stick with Castrol TTS, or equivalent injector oils from Rock Oil, Silkolene, Motul (and others), all of which are very good.
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Rich
MC21 Track Bike / RS250 NF5 'Spencer', NX5 'Cadalora' & NXA 'Aoyama' / RS500 / Two Brothers Racing RC30

Don't quote me on it, but I think Jeff from Rockoil said that their Castor Kart castor/synthetic blend can be injected. It's expensive though, and irrelevant as it's not available in Thailand!

Castor based oils were still recommended 20~25 years ago for its effectiveness at high RPM, and because as RichG says, fully synthetics were still in their (relative) infancy.

There's nothing wrong with fully synthetics these days, but you can't beat the smell of a little castor and AVGAS in your fuel mix!

Apparently several years ago Castrol used to sell a small sachet of fuel additive in Thailand to make it smell like you were using A747. Never seen it myself though.
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Andy.
NSR-WORLD.COM

Please keep all responses to Forum posts on the Forum so that others may benefit.

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If on unleaded then you want Castrol XR77. I use this in all my premix bikes. Smells great and as RichG says it is a replacement for 747 for use with unleaded. Is available in Bangkok. Contact Dirtshop in Bangkok as I think they sell it, or used to. Isn't Mega Dirt in Chiang Mai? Maybe they have it. Failing that I have a couple of cases.

Agip is also available if you need it, but they have two types. The 2T race oil and the 2T kart oil. The kart oil is not imported yet but I've tested the race oil (in drag race strokers not my bike!) and also gave a bottle to my mate to test in his karts. No problems. Contact Showpow in Bangkok, he has stock.

Synthetic oils are so good these days that I wouldn't worry about the benefits of castor oil, which is a fantastic lubricant, especially if you're only dealing with a motorcycle. The castor comes into it's own at very high rpm, which is why it's still the choice for fixed gear karts.

For injector use I always stick with Shell Advance. However, TTS is also very good. Both can be used in injector and premix forms.

At Castrol Technology Center in Bangkok I sat through several tests of various 2T oils. The two makes that stood out were Castrol and Shell. The one product that was way out in front in all high performance applications was A747. But it also came last in the low speed deposit test. Which basically means it you tickle around the town then you're far more likely to foul up using 747 than some cheapo 2T oil.

The best of the rest were Castrol TTS and Shell Advance. With Shell just sneaking it most counts.

One of the test which was fun to watch was the Kawasaki GTO125 (KH125) engine being held flat out while the fuel/oil ratios went leaner and leaner. A747 ran at something like 400:1 for a handful of seconds before locking solid

Thanks Matt for the information and with something substantial to back it up.Interesting stuff from Castrol Tech in BKK in that A747,although a 'Dinosaur' still outperforms new formulas.
I ll get in touch with Dirt Bike and order up the XR77.Using pre mix.
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My Bikes;
TZ250K
TZR250 3XV Sugo kitted track
TZR250 3XV modified road
NSR250R MC21 Rothmans
NSR250R MC18 Modified road
NS400R
Dio 80cc big bore with 26mm flatslide (wicked)
900RR Fireblade

Agip Kart is light years ahead of A747, the castor component has been refined to greater degree. There will be less verticle lines from inclusions, on the piston skirt with Agip than A747. Agip is cheaper to. Plenty of riders are using Castor/Sythetic blends(A747, Maxima 927 and Agip Kart) in oil pumps with no adverse effects. I use Agip kart in my vintage mxer that only revs to 6500rpm and yet to find any deposits or plug fouling(that's down to jetting and ignition anyway). Have an old cast iron cylinder in my shed that stayed rust free for about 5-6yrs after only ever running on castor, the bore was 'wet' and greasy to touch for ages.
"if you want to go faster, use castor"

How about if I wanna to race?.. Which is suitable?