I just purchased a pgm4 for my mc28 that I am rebuilding ( it came with mc21 clocks and PGM )
The small key that fits into the memory cards is missing , what is the key for and how much of an issue is it not having the original ?
Rob
Excellent . Thanks . The other question is regarding unlocking performance on a pgm4 .
Do I do a wiresplice and still need to get an HRC 030 card or is the splice enough . Or am i completely confused
I was recently chatting with a rather prominent poster on this forum and he said:
"I would guess that where a stock MC28 makes 39hp, one with JUST a wire splice will make 39hp, and one with a wire splice and an HRC card (no setup) would probably be lucky to make 45hp. The MC18 and MC21 on the other hand, with only a wire splice, will jump from 45hp to about 59/58hp respectively."
Has anyone actually dyno'd an MC28 with just the wire splice and an HRC card? OK, maybe with jetting changed as well.
Just curious, that's all. _________________ [color=#808080][size=9]Yes,.. I too know how to waste Time and Money,...
We've seen good ones, but it doesn't change the fact that the overwhelming majority of delimited MC28s do not perform as well as stock MC18s or MC21s, let alone those tuned "like-for-like".
The blue line is a stock MC21R with our airbox mod and wire splice, and a set of Swarbrick silencers. The red line is an MC28SP with HRC 030 card, HRC jet kit, HRC intake rectifiers, modified airbox, and TYGA race chambers (with special manifolds).
We can back up our claims all day long. Anyone is free to come down and prove otherwise. We've even offered to run bikes for free in the past, but no one is willing to step up. Funny that!
Given that we generally do a couple of runs to get a "base graph too", you can see the MC21R took just a couple of runs to set up. No one can claim we weren't trying with the MC28; there's a good 10~12 runs there, trying to extract the best out of it! _________________ Andy.
NSR-WORLD.COM
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Please DO NOT PM me for technical advice. My time is precious, and you will probably receive a faster response on the Forum anyway.
Not sure how many times we have been through this, but surely the only way to compare ignitions is to run them back to back on the same bike, same day, same dyno?
Comparing one bike with another is not an indication of anything other than the state of the bike on the given day and how well its been maintained/built......and if anyone is really bothered about 1.5 bhp then they should be taking a dump before they go for a ride as well ....or at least going on a diet!
I seem to remember another thread saying an MC21 made as much if not more power with standard pipes as it did with race ones so I fail to see the relevence unless they are running standard MC28 chambers.
I have absolutely nothing but praise for what you and Steve do, but until they are run side by side on the same bike I still cant see any reason why a HRC carded PGMIV wont perform equally as well as a PGMIII. My thoughts are that as long as we are getting 60bhp (ish) from a 20+ year old 250cc bike with the looks and handling the NSR's have then everyone should have a smile on their faces....although I do hope my 300 kitted MC28 makes more than that when/if I ever get chance to bring it down to you guys to set up. If you do I would be happy to sling a PGMIII on it for a comparison, if its much better then it will stay on it as well
The "problem" with that is you still can't just swap PGM's. The PGM-IV and PGM-III are programmed to run TB and TA carbs accordingly, and the MC28 runs considerably richer than an MC21, so the air correction is different.
We have run bikes and swapped "similar" PGMs (II's and III's) though, i.e. stock and HRC, and seen changes, but again, you can't do it without spending time on setup.
The long and the short of it is, the MC28 doesn't perform as well. It's a fact.
This is still one of the best (not the best) MC28 250s we've set up:
That's pretty much by the 94~95 HRC SP book, but without the million dollar AC generator. About as good as a stock MC21R, with a slight increase in peak and over-rev. It's not a very compelling argument.
The MC28 is a great road bike, and better than any other 250, but it was just a show-piece exercise at the end of the NSR's life-cycle. I would still have one over ANY other 250 however, and a Rothmans SP is still probably the best looking road 250 ever, even with its bendy swingarm!
Just telling it how it is! _________________ Andy.
NSR-WORLD.COM
Please keep all responses to Forum posts on the Forum so that others may benefit.
Please DO NOT PM me for technical advice. My time is precious, and you will probably receive a faster response on the Forum anyway.
I still regret never getting my old track 28 down to your dyno, but hey, that boat has sailed and was replaced with a NX5 for pretty much the same money
Interesting stuff Andy. I was offered an MC21 SE with my 28 when I bought it. Wish I'd grabbed both. Like you said, the 28 is a great road bike but it sure is expensive to get the sort of power you can easily get with the 21.
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....or at least going on a diet!
